# Meeting 17 4\\/25\\/1975

(Fred, 1/2/2010. This is the night the students from Bob Jones U. came to the W\.O.W. Hall.)

April 25, 1975

SERENA SAYS

SERENA: I'd like to start off tonight saying something some of you have heard, but we have some new people. There are a lot of stories going around town about who I am, and what I am, and what we do here on Friday nights. Of all the stories I don't think I have heard one that has been true yet.

What we do here is we gather a lot of people together, and we combine beliefs, and combine personalities and hand out a lot of love and an extremely large amount of God, and try to bring about a little bit of peace at least one of the seven days we have in this week.

We gather here, we chant, we pray, we talk, we learn, we love, we embrace just generally. We are here trying to be.

A lot of rumors are going around about who Serena is. Is it real? Is it unreal? Does it matter? What's real? What's unreal?

If we would all look past all the stories about where I came from. I've heard oh so many stories. I'll just name a few to keep everyone up.

There are some stories. Some of the stories say that this young lady over here with the blond hair (Pam Hamilton) who is a psychology major in college, that she and I have planned this, and it is all to write a term paper for school studying people's atti­tudes.

And then there are some who say that I am from outer space, another galaxy, and I have a body in Italy that's me incarnated from 5000 years ago.

And many other people say that Serena is a big fraud. But what is a fraud? For a person who claims to be one with everything, you can call me fraud, and you can call me real, because they are one and the same. Nothing exists but God. That is the whole thing. You don't have to believe me or disbelieve me, or love me, or like me. You just have to love God, serve God, and find your oneness with God. And I've had people who have come here get upset because I have Buddha sitting beside me and Jesus on the wall. And we sing all these chants about Krishna.

But what Jesus taught me, he said, "The Father and I are one."

And when I think of the Father, I think that God is one with every­thing, and I just think that no matter who we sit up here and say that they were great teachers who came to earth, they are all one. They all taught the same thing about God. There is one way, and that is when you say that there is not one way. That's the way.

A thousand people and one church and all thousand of them have different ideas about what the church is teaching. But that's alright, because we are all going to the same place. We have to. There is only one God, and no matter what we call him, he remains the one God. We might try to fool ourselves and say that there is two, but that's just ridiculous. That's illusion. There is one God, and we are all going to get to him, today.

Now what was I going to talk about tonight? Maybe this could be like a meditation, because things seem to sink in a little more and we can relax and learn a little more...

All men are one. All men are God. When we reject someone, we actually are rejecting ourselves. Murder is a form of suicide. Every enemy we have is an enemy because we see something in him that we see in ourselves also, and we don't like it. Every man is a mirror reflecting to us pictures of ourselves. When we throw trash along the highways, that is in reality us trying to rid ourselves of the trash within us. It might be unconscious, but that's what it is. When we don't like ourselves then we don't like others. When we find peace within ourselves, then we bring peace to others. We should meditate, because God said, "Be still and know that I am God."

That is a very simple statement. He didn't complicate it. He said just be still and know that I am God." The greatest silence the Buddha ever had was one day when he was to talk to a congregation of monks. And they were all very anxious to hear him speak. And he walked out and held up a flower, and that was it. Simple and illuminating. Within that flower contained a great deal of God that was waiting for someone to acknowledge it. A universe within itself. So Buddha just held it up and let everyone meditate on its splendor - the splendor of a magnificent creation given to us by God. When we meditate we should meditate on the God within our heart and bring Him into our hands and give Him unto the world. When we meditate, we should try to look with the eyes of our soul, which is one with God.

And see our hands as they really are - these physical hands that we have are sacred tools that were given to us to serve with. We should let those hands become divine mirrors and let them reflect to us all the things that are within us. That's illuminating.

So often we think of how we became a soul or why we are souls. But does anyone really know\... have we really given thought to:"Why am I a soul?" ? It's a good one.

At first there are a lot of people who believe that we are bodies who have souls, and then the people believe that we are soul with bodies, but in truth neither one really exists. To be in soul form is just a stage of development.

It's like a dream to live a great deal of time on earth, and it will pass away too.

So we have people who say that everything is physical. And then we have people who relate all to the soul. But in truth we should just relate it all to God. Transcend physical body, transcend soul body and get right to the source - soul.

In the beginning we are one with God, and the way we get into soul form is when we seek to know ourselves. We try to make ourselves into a fragment. We try to separate ourselves from the whole. And when we do that, it is a semi-false individuality that we obtain that causes me to say, "I am a soul and you are a soul." That cannot be true. That is limiting God. And we can't limit God. We must only say, "You are God and I am God." I see some bewildered faces. Does everybody understand? Harriet?

So if we transcend all the things that limit us. We talking about breaking down all the boundaries. But I don't know if we really do, because there are some men who are so in the material that they don't know if there is a God or if there is a soul. But then when we get out of that, we go to the other extreme, and we try to live totally with knowledge of the soul. But that too is a limitation, and so that will pass away. We reach a point when we find that we are not a fragment. We are the whole. It's God within God. Not God outside of God. Just God within God. And to be in soul form is only a temporary thing, and it won't last forever. I've -heard many people say that they pray to be soul infused. We shouldn't do that. We should just pray to love God, serve God, and become one with God, because God is all there is. So just remember that we do limit when we say, "I am a soul." Because that's just a stage of development and it will pass away. Because one day we will not want this false identity that we have when we say, "I am a soul, that is one with God." We will just say "I am one with God." "I am one with all things." "I am both in soul form and not in soul form - just one with all things." That's when we can liken it unto a drop of water being put into the ocean and it becomes the ocean. That's how it is with God. We are an ocean, and we are all tiny drops that make up God's divine ocean. Just some of us are trying to say, "I am a fragment, and I am not one with God." But we are one with God. And soon we can acknow­ledge that, but first we have to know who God is. We have to achieve better understanding than "a man in the sky." We have to see God in our brother and treat all men equally. And we have to see God in the sky and love that sky for what it is. We should see God in our food and eat the food for what it is. When we are in soul form we experience many things. That's why it is necessary to be souls - to have that semi-false identity of being a soul. Because this enables us to seemingly create a circle that is ready to be completed. We take on the identity of being a soul, a fragment of God, and set out on our circle to find ourselves. Now this soul identity or this entity iden­tity that we have brings about what is called the life and death cycle, which are nice mortal words to use. But the true meaning of life is a series of experiences building up impressions on our souls, and the true meaning of death is a rest period for these impressions many times. It is an interval between lifetimes or more so, between experiences. So that's life and death. And when we cling to life, we are being selfish, for we are not surrendering to God. And when we mourn for those who die that is a form of selfishness also. For they must find their oneness with God. And they can't do that if we wish to keep them here. The soul leaves this realm, or seemingly leaves this realm, and the impressions that it has come down here to gather are learned. So always when a dear one, or a close one, or even a not close one dies, we shouldn't mourn, because they're on their path. They're finding their oneness with God. And that's all we should want for them. To truly love someone would be to want them to have oneness with God as soon as possible. We've said many times that there is no happiness but the happiness that a man finds with, God, and there is no love but the love a man can have for God. So we should not cling to life, and we should not mourn over death. Both are illusion. The only real thing is finding God. And God has a plan for that. And we should so love God that we surrender to his plan and let it function.

We should not mourn, but rather we should give thanks that we can see his plan unfold in front of us. That we can see the workings of the universe right around us. Babies being born, people dying.

If we look at it just purely from a down to earth level, it's crude, it's sad, but if we look at it as God would have us look at it, we see the universe functioning under his care, and that's the miracle.

During these series of experiences that we have, we must experience being both male and female to balance. We have to experience all these things, and the reason we must experience being both male and female is that it is said that in the East, the males are more dominant with spiritual things and the woman is lesser. In the West it seems that the females are going after spirituality more so than males.

This is due to the large amount of business that we have in this country that occupies the males, and a lot of females. So if this is true, then we must experience both in the West and the East, male and female. Being dominant and being dominated until we can come to a point of balance. That's where the lessons lie.

So all these things we must experience because we have chosen to be in soul form, and that is just an acceptance just like it is to say, "I'm going to be on earth for a few more years to learn what earth has to offer." So the soul form will fade away, and you will merge one with God, one with all things.

All the rules of experience is governed by the law of karma, as it is called. At first we think of karma as bad, but I was thinking this afternoon that we could liken this soul's experiencing karma like a train on a railroad track. The train is the soul getting ready to go on a destiny. Karma is the track that allows us to go in exactly the right direction that we need to go. Always the things we must see the track brings to the train, and the way goes smoothly, even though we have bad scenery and good scenery, and bumps and level places. So all is ruled by the law of karma.

We reach a point on the spiritual plane where we must have a master or a master teacher, such as Jesus - all the great teachers that have been on earth. We have to do this because there are so many places that our ego gets involved. It seems that we can be really good-hearted and really be sincere with our beliefs, but ­sometimes the ego gets in the way and we feel that we are bigger than we should feel we are. If ever there is a time when you feel yourself greater than your brother, then go alone and pray, as Jesus said. Because we have to find our oneness. It's not who's going to get there first, or who can learn the most. We will find God when we find simplicity and not until. When we complicate things, that's what our mind becomes - total complication. We seek to know how the universe was formed, and who did this, and who did that. And that is all good to know, but let's not forget that no matter -how the universe is run, it's all run by God. And if we want to know what it is formed of, it's formed of pure, 100% God. God invented it. God put it all together. God is holding it all together. And God is loving every bit of it. That's the most important thing that we could ever learn. That in the simplicity of "God is everything," we will find everything.

But sometimes we seek to say, "My way is better." And I had a young girl the other night who told me, "Oh, I am advancing so rapidly." And I said "Watch your ego." She said, "I will, I will. But I am, really!"

We should never feel that we are advancing. There is nowhere to advance to. A flower in the process of unfolding, if you were to talk to it, it would not say, "I am advancing." It would merely say, "I am beginning to give what I am here to give." "It doesn't make me better, I'm doing this for you," the flower would say. If we look at what a flower does as the blossom comes out and the flower becomes beautiful, but the beauty doesn't do the flower as much good as it does us. It shows us God's creation, God's beauty. So we should be like the flower. We shouldn't be loving and serving God for us. We should be loving God and serving God for everyone else. When we find how to love God, and it is right within us, then we can love mankind. And when we love mankind we don't have to say a word, just love mankind. And mankind can see. And when we truly learn to serve, selfless service, then we can be an example for all of other mankind, and we won't have to say a word. We can just serve in front of mankind. And mankind will see. So that is what we are seeking to do.

Today I believe is a very important occasion in many parts of the earth. It's called the Wesak Festival. Today is when a lot of people around the world are celebrating Buddha's birth, death, and enlightenment. But when I started thinking about why should we celebrate when Buddha was born. Because a lot of men are born, and Buddha would never want to feel better than anyone else, so I tossed that one out. You can't celebrate Buddha's birth. And then I thought of Buddha's death, and I thought Buddha wouldn't want us to celebrate his death, many men die every day. And Buddha was one with them. So I tossed that one out. And I thought well, we could celebrate Buddha's enlightenment, but what better way would Buddha want us to celebrate that than to become enlightened our­selves.

So I don't know how I'm doing with the Wesak Festival.

I think we should just become enlightened and celebrate it every day with Buddha. But that's what's happening some places in the world. They celebrate that like they do Christmas here. And it is a big festival, I understand. A lot of nice things going on. Buddha makes sure he's there, and Jesus, and everyone is there to bless everyone. Only they don't just bless the people who know what's going on, they bless us all. So that's nice.

Meher Baba once said that we should all become like dust at the feet of the Master. And when people heard that they said, "Oh, my, why would we do such a thing?" And we see gurus from India: come over and we see people kiss their feet, and we go,"Oh, My, idol worship, idol worship." But I thought I would relate something to you today. The symbolism that we are missing, that is in India that we don't have here, that explains why they do this. It's not idol worship like we all think.

They kiss the Master's feet because the Master's feet in India represents the all of the universe. And when the initiate comes up and kisses him on the feet, then the initiate is placing all his impressions, all of his karma on the universe, or the feet of the Master.

And there is a ritual that goes with all this. The initiate goes up and kisses the foot of the Master, which is saying to the Master, "I am giving my will to you." And then he places a coconut beside the Master's feet. A coconut in India represents the mind, so all of this is a symbolic ritual of the initiates giving their all, including their mind unto God, so that God can help them find their oneness. Now you see this is something that has been confusing here. We just watch them do it and thought it was a very dreadful thing to think that people would be worshipping someone.

But if we look in truth, it is merely part of their ritual: just like to take of communion, or any of the other things we do. So if we really seek divine understanding of why people do things, then we won't be so quick to criticize, because criticism can't be all that well. So that's an example of how many people across the country have misinterpreted that all because we didn't know the customs of another land.

We didn't know what our brother was up to, so we judged him, and we judged him wrongly. And things like this go on all the time.

So if we seek divine understanding, then we will find understanding, and when we find understanding, we will find Jesus. Because with understanding lies compassion. And so it is.

Do you have any questions from anyone who would like to ask anything. Yes.

QUESTION: Do you believe in Jesus Christ?

SERENA: Yes, I do.

QUESTION: Do you believe in his blood?

SERENA: Do I believe what?

QUESTION: In his blood that he shed on the cross. In that? Do you believe?

SERENA: I believe in that, Yes. I believe that Jesus was the son of God who sacrificed everything he had, including his physical body. When I think of Jesus, I see a man far beyond a man, but who was willing to come to mankind's level. And I see that he so loved mankind and so loved God, that he gave and gave and gave, even though the people hated him and didn't want to listen to him. And he kept on giving and he kept on loving, and they kept on taking and kept on hitting and hurting until finally one day Jesus gave them what they had wanted all along, his physical body. So I believe in the blood on the cross.

QUESTION: (? almost inaudible) Do you believe that all men have to be saved and absorb the glory of God?

SERENA: Yes, I believe that God is creator and that he has given us all these things to experience with. And I believe that man as co-creator has taken what God has given him and we have brought about what is called evil. But, I also thought, "Mankind, why have you done this and why is it so big in this world?" Evil seems to dominate good everywhere we go. There is more hate than love. There is more violence than peace. So I sought an answer. And I thought back to Adam and Eve in the garden, going around, talking with God like all of us would so like to do. And then I could just picture God saying, "Adam and Eve." And they said, "Yes." And He said, "Don't eat of the tree in the middle of the garden. Some­thing horrible will happen. You will get wise." "What's wise?" "Well, just believe me. If you eat of that tree you won't have me anymore." "What's it like not to have you anymore?" "Just don't eat of that tree." "But why? Why? Why?" "Because I told you so." "But what does that mean?" They didn't understand. That's evident. If they had understood God, the magnificence of God, the power of God, and the love of God, they couldn't have eaten. Because when a man becomes merged with the love of God, and you find just a small amount of understanding, you just can't disobey. You so surrender to divine will that it just flows right through you. You couldn't fight it if you wanted to. So I see that mankind is like Adam and Eve, because that is the way this race started, many of you. And we didn't understand. So that shows me that we were lacking experience, and we needed it. And it wasn't until we ate of the tree, did exactly what God has told us not to do that we realized why we shouldn't have done it. You can't know what it is like not to have God until you don't have him. And then you see that you are missing something. It would be like putting a man inside a cave from infancy on. And for me to walk into that cave and shut the door quickly behind me, and sit down and proceed to tell him what sunlight looks like. And he would go, "How do I even know there is a sun? And how can I picture what light looks like? You mean there is something out there that shows warmth?" It would be very difficult for that man to understand.

There was a man who once said, "If the sun had never taken the form of the sun, then we with our eyes would never have perceived there was a sun." How true that is. We have to be shown. It is all a part of experience, I think. I think that we are coming out of it. But we can't say that we are all con­demned and we are all wrong. I think that God so loved us that he is letting us learn, and we are slowly and carefully and humbly finding ourselves back to him. That's what I believe.

QUESTION: I want to thank you for the few moments (inaudible)

SERENA: Yes, Sydney.

QUESTION: I've got a book, a Bible book, and it's got Adam and Eve in it. And it says that Jesus, I mean God, when he made Adam, he got some dust and formed it into a man and breathed into it, and it became a real man. And He made Eve. He put Adam to sleep and he took part of his rib and formed it into a pretty girl. And then she saw the tree of evil and good.

SERENA: Want me to tell you something else that wasn't in the book? Let me tell you why He took the handful of dust and made a man.

QUESTION: Why?

SERENA: Because that was symbolic.

QUESTION: And because it was so lonely and there were no people there.

SERENA: Right. Do you know why there were no people there?

QUESTION: Why?

SERENA: Because we were just beginning to experience being dust and plants and trees and birds.

QUESTION: And they didn't say, "Why, Why, Why". Because they would begin to die, that was why.

SERENA: Right. 'But if you had never died before, and if you had never seen anyone die. Then if I told you that you might die, you would probably say, "What's that?" "Well, you won't be living anymore?" And you would say,"Well what's it not like to not be living any more?" If you had never seen death. But you see you have. So if I tell you, then you know what it means. But if God had told Adam and Eve that, which he did, they didn't understand, because there were only two people. And they had never died before, and they hadn't seen anyone else die.

QUESTION: When this other spirit, it wasn't a good spirit, it was a bad spirit.

SERENA: There aren't any bad spirits.

QUESTION: Well, there was when Adam and Eve were. It said it in the book.

SERENA: Let me tell you Sydney. The snake that was up in the tree, that Eve went over to... The snake represents wisdom and energy, and so the snake was symbolic of what was inside Eve already. Wisdom and a lot of energy. And the energy activated her charkras.

QUESTION: Well, this spirit told Eve that God was trying to make fun of them. And he said, "The fruit is good. The fruit will make you live." And so she took some of the fruit, and ate it, and gave some of it to her husband, and then a voice called...

SERENA: I think we can take it from there, dear.

QUESTION: And it was God's voice, and they were scared, and they hid in the trees because they were scared that he would get mad.

SERENA: Wait, Sydney. You said that Eve thought that God was making fun of her, but that proves that if Eve had really known God, and who God was, she would know that God would never make fun of her.

QUESTION: I know. I know more.

SERENA: Thank you for adding a lot to our session.

Are there any more questions?

QUESTION: You say you don't believe in evil spirits.

SERENA: No, I don't.

QUESTION: You don't believe in demons either?

SERENA: I believe in the demons of man.

QUESTION: Do you believe in the Bible?

SERENA: Very much so.

QUESTION: What about the demons cast out by Christ?

SERENA: When Jesus walked the earth, there were evil spirits or so-called negative energies which could overtake mankind. But that is one of the things that Jesus accomplished while on the earth. And that is with Jesus' coming that no longer would evil dominate man as it did and some of it now. The only evil spirits or so ­called possessions that can take place today are not possessions but obsessions. This occurs when we are so attached to the physical realms, smoking or drinking or lust or greed or anger, that when we pass from this world, we can't go on. We refuse to leave this world behind. And when that happens, we seek to find a vehicle for us to experience with down here. And being that we are in the spiritual realm, or the astral, and we are experiencing complete anger and need a fulfillment for it, then we will search on earth and find someone who has anger and experience through them this obsession. And then there are people who cannot give up drinking and shed the physical. Many times a drinking problem brings us back to earth as much as we can, and some hover around bars and try to experience people who are drinking also.

So the greatest evils are those that are in mankind. The harm that we do to each other daily. If you walk down the street and have someone smile at you and you do not smile back, that's as evil as we could ever get. I think that the evil comes from within. The only sin is the lack of God. Because if we had Jesus Christ in our lives, then we would not be sinners. Jesus said, "Come and follow me, for it is through me that you can get to the Father." So if a man is said to be a sinner, I know that he is not a sinner, he is just imperfect. Imperfect because he does not know the Christ. He is not one with God. He may have some outside voices, but from the inner voice he has not yet heard.

QUESTION: What do you think God means when He speaks of Satan in the Bible? Said to be cast in the Lake of Fire in the book of Revelation.

SERENA: I think that is symbolic of the "Satan" within us.

QUESTION: But there is a verse also in the New Testament that says that Satan is walking about on this earth seeking (inaudible) trying to take over our lives.

SERENA: Right. I believe that too, like I said. I believe that there is enough evil within mankind to take care of any devil. And for us to think that God is so mighty and so loving and so just, I cannot see that he would have an archrival enemy who could run up to his throne every day. I think the one who runs up to the throne and talks about God's people is our own hearts, that talk to God continuously. I think the evil is within us that seeks to destroy us. And the evil that is within us seeks to destroy other men also. Because when we are when we are unhappy, miserable, then we feel that we need to be evil. We always touch another man's lives, always. Everything on the earth interrelates and interpenetrates. Everything touches everything else. Everything is a part of everything else. Everything is the same. Everything.

We are constantly on the earth planes together. It is said, "within one tree resides all forests. Within one river, the water of all oceans. Within one man, all of mankind." That's how close we are. And if we are unhappy, others feel our unhappiness. If we are happy, other men feel our happiness. That's why we are seeking God. There need be no evil if we can find peace with God, but this won't come but with God. It can't come through words, it has to corne through experience. So the greatest evil, that part which is within us, that part which controls us rather than us controlling it.

QUESTION: Well then, if (inaudible) to sin, you don't believe that Jesus Christ will come back again and deliver...

SERENA: Yes, I'm patiently waiting.

QUESTION: You believe in a physical coming back?

SERENA: I believe in a physical coming back.

QUESTION: Where will we go then?

(tape change)

SERENA: If we had no suffering, yet still could do harm unto our brother, there would be no lesson there. It would not be any plan at all for God to merely create us full of God and never let us feel any pain or anything - just God. We need to feel it all. Because God is one with everything, and we want to experience it all so that we might understand him more and more. When we our­selves have pain, if we are wise, we understand the pain of other men. When we rejoice, if we become wise, we understand the rejoicings of other men. When we understand other men, then we will understand God, but not until. To know the gods, we must first know our mankind. That's something we are leaving out. Instead of seeking to understand why a man might believe this or that, we condemn it and run from it. We criticize it. And we go on seeking God . Jesus said, "Love ye one another as I have also loved you. And when Jesus came to earth, we didn't make it too nice for him down here. And if we sit and say, "That was back then, we wouldn't it today." Yes we would. We do it to our brothers every day. Many a man is crucified every day not in the flesh but within. And that's as painful as anything else. Love ye one another as I have also loved you. And when Jesus came down here and we look back on his life, he gave everything he had to everyone he came into contact with. And there were people who hated him and people who loved him. And he loved them equally. So that is how we must be also. If a man condemns us, seek understanding as to why he must condemn. I've often said that if a man wishes to step on you, lie down and let him stand on your stomach. And if he still needs to step on you, rollover that he might also stand upon your back. Because if a man needs to do something that much, let us not let him burden his mind with merely dreaming of harming us, but let us let him harm. If thou are smitten on one cheek, turn thou the other.

QUESTION: I've been wondering reading the Bible trying to find the answer to this. When we have sin in our lives and as it is termed in the Bible, it says we have all sinned and sin comes short of God's glory, it makes the guilt come out. How is this guilt taken away? How is that sin paid for? How do we get rid of the sin?

SERENA: Well, if we just start right today (I'll give you a little bit of Bible interpretation Serena style) When Lot's wife looked back she turned into a pillar of salt. Look ye not back on the yesterdays or anything you had there or did there. Because when Lot's wife did she turned to salt. We can only do it today. We can only serve today. Love God today. If we were foolish yes­terday, be not more foolish today and only think of your foolish­ness yesterday. We have to begin somewhere. And it can be right now. Guilt is self punishment. And if we love God, we do not have the right to punish ourselves. If we give all unto God, then let God do what he himself would do with us. And if we clutter our mind with guilt and dreams of yesterday, then God can't work through us. And we find it hard to pray, and we find it hard to be happy. And we find it hard to smile. So if we turn to God today, imagine yourself going before an altar, and let Jesus stand before the altar and pile up all your yesterdays, the ones you remember and the ones you don't and put them on a tray he has sitting on the altar, the altar where the one candle burns, the Holy of Holies in Biblical terms. And give Jesus Christ every­thing you ever did, everything you are doing now, and everything you ever will do. And let him take it from there. Don't let guilt wear you down. Just let God fill you up. We can't change what we did yesterday. But we are in perfect control of tomorrow. And the control lever is right here today. So let us become wise.

QUESTION: If a person doesn't seem to feel guilty for the things that they do to other people, is that a lack of experience? They don't know what it is?

SERENA: Yes, it is.

QUESTION: When you said that you believe in the blood of Jesus Christ, how come your songs are geared more toward God and getting oneness with God? I don't think I saw any songs that talked about the blood of Jesus Christ.

SERENA: Well, you haven't been here every week. We have changed our songs, but we have done a lot of talking about Jesus. In fact up until tonight most of the things I've said are Jesus ori­ented. And we've gone over the story of the crucifixion, and the being saved through Jesus, trying to seek understanding. But we find that there are so many people in the world, and all of them have so many different beliefs that we have to seek understanding of why a man would believe differently from us, and when we find this understanding, it shows us that there is only one God. Because we see God's creatures are everywhere, and he loves us all equally. And in loving us all equally and yet we all believe different things. I don't believe God would let a man be blind, not a whole group of men, not thousands of men that have never heard of Jesus Christ. And yet when you talk to people about Krishna Conscious­ness, and you say, "Jesus Christ", they say, "Yes, I know about Jesus Christ, and I love him." And most of the Masters in India have tables like this, and they have their picture up there, and many times they have a picture of Jesus. And they sit and they follow Krishna as their Master, and they sit and talk about Jesus and weep in front of the people. Because the whole world knows who Jesus was, and what he did. And when we say God, we are inclu­ding Jesus, we are including all of mankind. And we are including all creatures, knowing that when say God, we are saying the word Jesus Christ with the greatest power we ever could. And when we say oneness with God, then we are talking about becoming one with the love of Jesus Christ as much as anyone ever could.

QUESTION: Serena, I think that the greatest song that Jesus ever gave us was the Lord's Prayer, because it was He who said, "Our Father, who art in heaven."

SERENA: Yes.

QUESTION: How can we know whether it is the direction of God as to what we are doing with our lives and just a reflection of our own feelings, and doubts (inaudible)

SERENA: If you place yourself completely in the hands of God then we cannot fill ourselves with worry of "Is it real or is it unreal?" If we really love God, and give ourselves to God like we say, then let us also have faith and put ourselves so totally in his hands that we accept things knowing that if we have been misguided, then our love for God will shine forth unto God, and God will let us know. That is where our faith comes in. All we can do is the best we can do. And when we give all unto God, that's what it is. Having faith and ye shall be made whole. If we turn to God, he won't let us be misguided.

QUESTION: You spoke before at the beginning that you combine all, beliefs (inaudible) together. I was wondering in II Corinthians 6, where it says (inaudible) with darkness", and I was wondering for instance in many of the religions today, they don't believe in the death of Jesus Christ on the cross as atonement for sins, and different things that are found in the Bible, and if that is classified as unrighteousness in the Bible, then how can we have fellowship with it.

SERENA: It· can only be unrighteousness if we say it is. Because we look all over the world and even go to your churches here in town, and I see people that still can't quite grasp on to things that I find quite natural, but I can!t condemn them. It's just lack of understanding. If it is really truth, then I shouldn't burden myself with worry or criticize what they believe. If it's really truth, then God will have them know it sooner or later. That is where our faith comes in also. When I talk to people about Jesus I find that many men have different interpretations and he said the same words. And when I go and I talk to people about Krishna, there are things that they disagree on among themselves, different interpretations. So this shows me that men all over the world, since we are not perfect, but we are becoming so, then we could make mistakes. But a mistake can only be big if we let it be. If we, like I said, place ourselves in God's hands like I do. My prayer was, "I want to help you unify yourself upon this world. And that is what my mission is. If I make a mistake, correct me. In fact if I go to say something wrong, stop the words before they come out of my mouth." That's how much faith I've got in what I say, and in what I say I am. And all the words I speak. Because I think that I love God so much and I give him so much even though I have more to give, because we are all learning, then he's not going to let me misguide a lot of people. That would not further his purpose. So therefore that heips me accept the beliefs of all mankind. Knowing that we can all make mistakes. But someday we will make no mistakes.

QUESTION: (inaudible) We hold on to the fact that Jesus was a man. Sure He was a man, but He was the body, the physical, mental body that God sent his Love in. If we would substitute the word Love every time we say Christ, I think it would mean different. And you can find no fault in the word Love. Love has no nationality, love has no religion. Love is. Love is God. So when you say Christ, say love.

SERENA: O.K. I surely will. Thank you very, very much.

QUESTION: What does the Bible mean when there is mentioned the unpardonable sin? Do you think that there is an unpardonable sin?

SERENA: Yes, because we make it unpardonable. The unpardonable sin or the worst sin there is is the one when we say that there is no God and we need no guide. We can't let God forgive us, because we're not even giving God credit for being God to forgive us. So that is how we can't be forgiven for that one. We're not even saying that there is a God who can forgive us, so how can we believe in forgiveness. Therefore it is the unpardonable sin.

QUESTION: Would it be necessary for someone to experience (inaudible)

SERENA: Yes, it is. We have to know total absence of God to know total devotion to God.

QUESTION: "God is love," I know it says that in I John somewhere, but that is not all God is, because God is also fully without sin. God is also the God of judgment, he's the judge, and God cannot tolerate sin in men.

SERENA: Right. But I think if I know this man as I feel I do, he was speaking of love in the most divine sense, and divine love is exactly what Jesus was. We wouldn't have to say Jesus Christ, we could say: "Divine Love Manifested", because that's what he was. Am I correct?

QUESTION: Right.

SERENA: That's what I thought, Yes. Divine Love takes in all power, all knowledge, and all bliss, all purity, all truth, all wisdom. Divine Love is the ocean of God, pure in itself.

QUESTION: I think when you speak about Jesus' great humility, everyone talks about that fact that He said that He was the only way. But for every time that he said that, he said tens of times that anything He says is nothing but the words of God.

SERENA: That's true. How many times did he say, "It is not I, but my Father."

QUESTION: Love lS the way. For He is love.

SERENA: And Jesus is love, and when love is on the earth. He said there is nothing but my Father, which is total love. So that shows us that mankind can't go wrong. That we have many beliefs, and we have to be going to the same God. We have to.

Thank you very much. Any more questions? I thought so.

QUESTION: The Bible says you must be born again. It also says, "Except ye be born again, ye cannot enter the Kingdom of God." What to you does that mean?

SERENA: That means what I was talking about. When we don't know God, we are dead. We are alive in the physical, but without God there is nothing. I believe that God loves us so much that He doesn't get rid of us right then. I believe that God lets us keep on going until we see the truth. I think the truth is so mighty and so beautiful and so powerful and so all-encompassing that it seems to overshadow any hell that there might be. The hell we create is our own. I think God sustains us enough and wants us to love Him, because He loves us so much that we live quite a long time. And that's not believing in·reincarnation. The soul is eternal. The soul is everlasting, for it is one with God. So I believe we continue, and if we continue ...You have think of it this way, it's inevitable that we are going to someday reach God. Because if we sin and we don't know God and if there was a hell and we went right down into the deepest pit, I bet at that point we would recognize what we should have done when we were on earth. And when God saw us recognize, he can't let us go on burning there! Not when we are sitting there knowing that we should love God and realizing things for the first time that we never realized before. So therefore, all men shall become one with God.

QUESTION: In the Old Testament, where it is spoken of God casting Satan and his followers, his angels, down into hell. Being a literal God there, and the way it is presented, it seems to be a literal Satan and literal angels, therefore a literal hell. He does not cast a being into a place that does not exist.

SERENA: Well, if God is everything, and God is all things, and we are one with God, therefore we are all things. Then the heaven is within us, and the hell is within us. And when we seek God, we find the heaven. When we seek no God, we find the hell. And when Jesus walked the earth, and evil forces dominated men and he made men strong by telling them about God, then He bound up that part which could dominate man and cast it into that part of us and locked it up. He locked it up that it might no longer roam around free, but if we pry the gates of hell open, we can have all we want. It's all within us.

To show that there is both a heaven and a hell within us, if a man seeks to love, he finds he is equipped to love, that God has put within him all the things we need to love with. If a man seeks to become angry, just watch. Every tool you and device you need to get angry with, you have right within you, abundantly. You can get absolutely as angry as you ever wanted to be. It's all right there. It doesn't have to come flying out of the sky, it's right within you. And if you seek to serve, you discover that there's a part of you that knows where to serve and how to serve and the humility you need to serve. Therefore you are equipped to serve. And if a man seeks to lust, behold, he has many tools to lust with. Man is a complete completeness within himself. Anything we seek, so shall we find. If we seek God, the heaven that is within us, that is one with God, shall come forward and shall reign upon the earth. For as it is above, so shall it be below, if we let it be. But if we turn from God, then the hell within us comes forth, and we spread that upon the world. Jesus did bind it up, but where is he going to put it, except within God. Because God is all things. But that doesn't mean God is evil, not by any means. It just means that all creations are a part - we are all within the gigantic body of God. Everything that happens is an expression of his face. It can be like unto that. So when Jesus bound him up and put him in hell, the hell is within us, and also within us is the heaven where Jesus said, "I go to my Father to prepare a place for you."

QUESTION: Did God cast Satan into each one of us so that Good and Evil could dwell in us at the same time?

SERENA: And therefore we have free will. And Jesus says, "If ye seek me, and if you ask in my name, so shall it be granted." And what does Satan say? "If you want me, you can have me." We can have anything we want.

QUESTION: Can God dwell where sin is dwelling, where evil is present?

SERENA: No, but God can be both within you. He can be both evil and good, being that he has given you both, for the purpose of choosing. "What will you do with them?" He says, "Will you love me, or will you turn from me?" I give you both.

QUESTION: God couldn't cast Satan into us. If he loves us so much, there is no way he could cast evil into us. We cast it into ourselves.

SERENA: No, we bring it forward from ourselves.

QUESTION: It's in us. He loves us so much there is no way, with all his love, that he could cast evil into us. We hang on to Satan.

SERENA: Right. That's true, because we are co-creators. But God so loves us, that He has to give us the choice to see if we want to love Him. He wants us to. But you are right. Whether we want to or not is our problem. But still if everything is within God and I can't see that anything but God can exist, then where is the heaven going to be, and where is the hell going to be? Is it above us? Is it farther away than the moon? And where is hell? How do We get there? Is that not within God? And if it is the soul that goes to hell or to heaven, and the soul is one with God, then do we take our part of God to hell? Or do we take our part to heaven? And if we are one with God, and everything is God, then that's within us right now. We have the ability to do either one.

QUESTION: Serena, if we are all one with God, and God is everything, then certainly nothing exists except God. If this is the case, why did God bother to create all of mankind? Why did God send himself out to gather experience? Why did God create man?

SERENA: Mankind is an expression of God seeking to know himself.

We are one with God, fragments of the whole. Yet in truth we are the whole. Each of us are a thought of God. We are God complete, but have not acknowledged it, have not found that part within us that can love and serve and give to mankind. We are God experiencing God's own self. We chose to do this. In the beginning, before we have experience, we so surrender to God that we agree to come and experience. Become as a small child, as innocent, as willing as a child. That is what we were in the beginning. And as it is in the beginning, so must it be also near the end. So we were so willing to give to God, that we chose to stiffer and rejoice, and to see the beauty of both, because God is everything, and it is all part of the plan that we know it all, or we cannot know God. So we are God experiencing himself. The Hindus, as Fred was telling me, liken it unto God playing hide-and-go-seek with Himself. That's what we're doing. We are all God, and we are hiding ourselves under the veil of illusion and seeking ourselves through the path of reality ­only to find that there was experience in all of this.

QUESTION: I was wondering - there's been a lot of discussion over the Bible - if there happened to be a Bible in the room, would you just open it and read.

SERENA: I love the Bible, too. Anything in particular? Ohhh. (laughter) How nice. I'm in Daniel. (Daniel 4: 28)

1. All this came upon the king Nebuchadnezzar. 29. At the end of twelve months he walked in the palace of the kingdom of Babylon. 30. The king spake, and said, "Is not this great Babylon, that I have built for the house of the kingdom by the might of my power, and for the honour of my majesty?" 31. While the word was in the king's mouth, there fell a voice from heaven, saying, "O king Nebuchadnezzar, to thee it is spoken; The kingdom is departed from thee. 32. And they shall drive thee from men, and they dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field; they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will."

   Nebuchadnezzar was driven to hell, driven to eat grass such as the oxen that he might learn humility.

   Nebuchadnezzar was driven to suffering that he might understand why he needed God - to give unto all mankind. And at the end of the suffering, I continue, Nebuchadnezzar said,

   "34. And at the end of the days I Nebuchadnezzar lifted up mine eyes unto heaven, and mine understanding returned unto me and I blessed the most High, and I praised and honoured him that liveth for ever, whose dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom is from generation to generation 35. And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing, and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabi­tants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou? 36. At the same time my reason returned unto me; and for the glory of my kingdom, mine honour and brightness returned unto me; and my counsellors and my lords sought unto me; and I was established in my kingdom, and excellent majesty was added unto me. 37. Now I Nebuchadnezzar praise and extol and honour the King of heaven, all whose works are truth, and his ways judgment: and those that walk in pride he is able to abase."

So in this story, what I gather Nebuchadnezzar was doing wrong, so God drove him to the fields to make him like a beast and make him eat grass. And when this happened, Nebuchadnezzar, for the first time, knew why he needed God. And through this experience sought to praise the God that he had not known before. We should also praise God.

QUESTION: Very well. I was wondering, you seem very well educated, and speak very well. I was wondering where you got your training. (laughter)

SERENA: Don't let them kid you. They just think that is funny because they've asked the same thing. My training just seemed to come with me. A package deal. I do a lot of seeking within myself. And one day I was seeking, and I think I found what I was looking for. And when I found it, I saw that I had been a man, or one of mankind, I had journeyed many times, I had seen many things, heard many things, spoken many things, and I saw that I had completed my journey. That I had been seeking God for a long time, and one day I found it. And when I realized that I had found my goal, I became my goal. And I became not only the goal but the journey which I have been upon. And when I became the journey, I saw that other men were upon that journey, so I saw that it was that I would perhaps be a teacher, but better than a teacher, I would be a talker. And when mankind would open himself to listen unto me, I would tell him the things that I have seen, and the things that I have done. And I would tell of the words that my Father spoke to me when I returned to Him. He called me "Child," and He called me "Son", and a voice far mightier than I have ever heard spoke around me and through me, and the voice told me that I would travel all upon the earth, and that many men I would talk to, and a few would not listen. And He told that I would be His servant, an abundantly filled vessel, belonging totally to God. That I would be His eternal vessel, and I would do what I am doing tonight.

QUESTION: You never went to a university or anything like that?

SERENA: No, I haven't.

QUESTION: I just want to say that we have to leave, and I hope you will not be insulted, but we have to be back at a certain time.

SERENA: Yes. I am very glad you could come. Very glad. Most honored to have you here. Blessings be with you.

I learned all this in the universe but not in a university.

Nice night!

QUESTION: These notes said, "As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end." But when we reach that point we are back at the beginning and (inaudible)

SERENA: That's the whole idea. Very good. You caught on to what I said. That's right. "As in the beginning, so shall it be near the end." Because we are on a circle, and if you start at the top of the circle and complete the circle, then the end is right within the beginning. So you become the circle.

QUESTION: Once the circle is completed, then there is no longer a beginning or an end.

SERENA: Then we just are. That's when we can truly be still and know that God is God. O.K., shall we end in prayer now?

Oh, Father, thank you for this opportunity, for we see that many lessons have been laid before us tonight. Help us to under­stand, to love where we find it difficult to love, to give where we find it difficult to give, to be when we find it difficult to be. Help us to understand, because in understanding lies compassion. And when we find compassion within ourselves, we are touching the very hand of Jesus. Eternal love, eternal wisdom. May we do as you would have us do. Forevermore. In Your Name.

And another thing, may we have many nights such as this one.

And may the few turn into many that will hear your words. May all of mankind have praises upon their lips. And may we seek to teach other about You.

Amen.
